Paper Economy - A US Real Estate Bubble Blog

Monday, May 18, 2009

The Almost Daily 2¢ - Sunshine Indictor Still Dark

Longtime readers know that my overall outlook for the U.S. economy is grim.

To me, it appears clear that our current economic decline did not start in December 2007 but rather in 2001 when our typical boom and bust business cycle pattern gave way to a, more or less, continuous bust only briefly interrupted by the main thrust of our historic and phenomenally immense and delusional late-cycle credit and housing bubble.

Without the credit and housing bubble our “jobless recovery” would have been a “recovery-less recovery” or, more precisely, no recovery at all.

To put things in perspective a bit, during the “recovery” period following the dot-com bust our economy regained all the jobs lost in the recession and even added 5.622 million new jobs.

Unfortunately though, over the same period the workforce population grew by over 19 million individuals.

Worse yet, since the start of the housing recession in December 2007 our economy has lost 5.73 million jobs.

So we are below the actual employment level seen in late 2000 and we are sliding still further… an unprecedented trend for the post-WWII U.S. economy.

Nonetheless, all we have is history to compare against in order to determine when and how this latest cyclical decline (possibly another sub-cycle in a longer trending decline) will play out.

In an effort to gain a fairly timely and accurate account of the trend I have formulated the “Sunshine Indicator” (click for much larger image) which exploits a pretty solid relationship between industrial production and the national unemployment rate.

Currently the indicator is still flashing “decline” but it will be interesting to see its pattern shape up over the next three months.

Labels: , ,

Copyright © 2013
PaperEconomy Blog - www.papereconomy.com
All Rights Reserved

Disclaimer

14 Comments:

  • Right, so you are trying to discredit any growth that occured in the last 9 years. well you may just as well discredit the last 100 years of industrialization. Lets just say none of it really happened.

    By Anonymous flota, at 1:50 PM  

  • This blog is a perfect controrian indicator for the stock market

    Monday, March 02, 2009
    Prime Bomb: An Epic Race for the Exits!

    By Anonymous flota, at 1:51 PM  

  • "flota said...
    This blog is a perfect controrian indicator for the stock market

    Monday, March 02, 2009
    Prime Bomb: An Epic Race for the Exits!"

    Not really, SATT is a permadoomer, he was just as bearish in Mar 09 as he was in Mar 07, and likely since Mar 01.

    He kinda reminds me of the 1930's economist, Ralph Nelso Elliott. In 1938, he was convinced that "weve only just started - much more pain to come - blah blah blah").

    He was saying the same thing in 1945 - the war interupted the decline - weve got too much debt - living standards will decline - blah blah blah.

    By 1947, most people quit listening to him then in 1948, he died - thinking the worst was yet to come. Had he been alive, he would likely say, that this downturn is vindication for everything he believed. Sorry, but my general rule is, if the cataclysm you expect doesnt come in your lifetime, you have to wonder if just maybe you have a "too doomish" outlook to reflect reality.

    It will be the same thing here - as the recovery unfolds, smart guys like SATT will remain unconvinced - "dead cat bounce, kicking the can down the road, blah, blah, blah" nothing can change the view of the permabear - meaning his blog will become more and more irrelevant as he refuses to come around that maybe, just maybe, his pre concieved ideas of how bad it "has to be" wont come to pass.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:49 PM  

  • Note - for the sake of full disclosure. I personally believe that were not done. I think this is a dead cat bounce & weve got one more (smaller) leg down to go.

    That said, I respect the indicators for what they are - and they are suggesting that maybe I too am a bit too doomish. 6 months ago, I would have said "there is a 90% chance weve got another leg down", I now think there is a "60% chance there is another leg down". If indicators continue to suggest I am too bearish will continue to adjust my outlook to comport with reality.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:00 PM  

  • flota and anon,

    The stock markets are below their nominal values and seriously below their real values of 9 years ago ... the job level is below its level of 9 years ago and seriously below on a population adjusted basis... the banking system is an obvious fraud... millions of households are broke/in foreclosure/bankruptcy... even the dual income urban elite are against the ropes...

    American households, firms and the government are all seriously burdened by debt and obligations...

    I'm not sure what else I can say but this era is not going to resolve to easily... call me a perma-doomer if you want but I don't see you offering any explanation for why the economy has failed to create any jobs in 10 years (created some then lost them all and then some) why the stock market has failed to have any sustained recovery (massive bear market rally after 2002 failed and dropped even lower)..

    You think things should just bounce back ... as if they ever actually bounced back after the last recession... don't you see?

    You are both foolish and shortsighted...

    By Blogger SoldAtTheTop, at 6:51 PM  

  • You are both foolish and shortsighted...I really need to chuckle at this one. The fool is the one that only sees one side of the equation. History shows that recovery eventually happens.

    You think things should just bounce back ... as if they ever actually bounced back after the last recession... don't you see?They always bounce back, maybe not to the previous level, but they do. Anyway 1999 and 2000 cannot even be compared as they are an anomaly in the market.

    By Anonymous flota, at 9:30 PM  

  • This blog is a perfect controrian indicator for the stock market.Well, if not this blog, how about this...
    Insider Selling Adds To Cautious ToneNEW YORK (Dow Jones)--Those who know the most about their company are now selling, a possible sign that other investors should do likewise.

    Historically, insider buying has been one of the best indicators that a broad market gain was imminent. In both late November and early March, a wave of insider buying correlated with market bottoms that predated more than a month's worth of stock rallies.

    By Blogger Tyrone, at 9:53 PM  

  • History shows that recovery eventually happens.Quite the opposite, actually. History shows that all empires eventually fall. What evidence do you have that the current downturn is not the waning of the US as the world's superpower? I'm not saying that it necessarily is, but your rebuttal of "recovery always happens" is entirely devoid of substance and not reassuring.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:19 PM  

  • Foolish and shortsighted for thinking there is a 60% of another leg down? Foolish and shortsighted for paying attention to those indicators which say I may be wrong? Foolish and shortsighted for thinking maybe the govt just kicked the can down the road for 5-10 more years? Foolish and shorsighted for thinking that this recession, the strongest and most powerful one we have seen in decades, might have run its course?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:35 AM  

  • By the way, I dont think one single solitary god damn thing is going to "bounce back". I think this MIGHT be the beginning of the L shaped recovery. How foolish and shortsighted of me...

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:38 AM  

  • US as the world's superpower" Looks like Anon is stock in 20th century. No this is the age of corporate power.

    By Anonymous flota, at 8:57 AM  

  • This comment has been removed by the author.

    By Blogger bostonbubble, at 9:38 AM  

  • Can you please provide a table of values that you used to make this graph for us dummies, say since 1980 or so? Thanks.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:56 AM  

  • anon,

    Send an email to soldatthetop@gmail.com and I will send you the data.

    By Blogger SoldAtTheTop, at 7:03 PM  

Post a Comment



Links to this post:

Create a Link

<< Home


 
Top Real Estate Blogs Top Real Estate Blogs Blogarama - The Blog Directory Check Google Page Rank